Questions for Canadians..........

[Staci Matheis]

Do you guys lock your doors at night?

Are you allowed to own handguns?

Why do you think that the United States has so many more deaths from firearms than Canada?



These questions are prompted by me going to see the film "Bowling for Columbine" last night..........



There were some interviews done in Canada. At one point, the producer walked up to random doors in a neighborhood and tried them; they were all unlocked!



They showed Canadians practicing with handguns at a firing range; yet I remember going to Canada in 1985 to hunt black bear and was told not to bring a handgun because, if I remember correctly, they were illegal. Or was it just illegal for me to bring one across the border?



Finally, the film makes some suggestions as to why our statistics on death by firearms are so much higher than your's..... I was just wondering what you guys thought.....



Thanks and God Bless!

me!

 

[Bill McElroy]

Michael Moore,....now there's a guy who made a complete ass---of himself on national TV....glad they booo'ed the $#%@ out of him!!

 

[Mark Gross]

Scott did you watch any of the academy awards? Did you agree what Michael Moore said about are president? Just wondering.

 

[Staci Matheis]

No, Mark, I didn't watch the awards.



On this one, I'm not going to make any comments. (Can you believe THAT from ME! LOL!!) I just want to be neutral and see what others think.

 

[Bill McElroy]

Handguns are illegal to own in Australia too,..their murder rate is up 20% and climbing FAST since they past that law...criminals have free reign to do as they please with virtually NO FEAR of repriasal from their victims.....go figure!

 

[Pierre Voisine]

Scott,



I contemplated sending you an email or replying here, but I guess this should make for a good discussion.



There are BIG differences when it comes to safety in Canada. First, we do have weapons and crime, but at a much lower rate. Every firearm in Canada must be registered (even though it's costs us an arm and leg) as we do not have the right to bear arms. We must take a course, get a license and apply to buy a weapon. I'm not sure of the legal aspects between the purchase of a hunting riffle and hand gun, but there are limitations, such as purchasing automatic weapons...difficult at best.Crossing the boarder with a firearm is illegal.



Personally I lock my doors at night, but, there are many nights I forget, without worry. I know many people who don't.



I've been lucky enought to travel to many of the major US cities, or cities around the world to appreciate how lucky I am. We can walk through an alley in downtown Toronto, and besides getting begged for change to death, we do not need to worry.



One other interesting point is that we cannot walk into a pawn shaop and see hundreds of guns. Acces to them is semi limited, someone who tries hard enough can, but it's nowhere nearly as easy as in the US. In my circle of friends, I know of two hunters who have weapons....that's it, nobody has gun for protection.



i've had discussion about the WHY part with many American friends before, and my opinion is the problem lies in the second amendment. The right to bear arms is an important one for you but it also opens the opportunity for companies to push products to market and create a redily accessable platform. You can get a firearm anywhere in the states.



the other reason lies in the strenght of our beer....we pass out before we get mad.



Pierre

 

[Dewey Leggett]

Does anyone live near the Illinois town (Morton Grove?)where they outlawed guns or the Georgia town (was it Kennesaw?) where they passed a law saying you HAD to have a gun in your house? What has happened there. That should be able to help us evaluate the issue a little.

 

[Bill McElroy]

I could tell you about an "incident" that happened in Australia at my Bro's house when he and his family were down there for 4years....he has 2 teenage daughters and they lived in a ranch house with large sliding glass doors in each bedroom. Considering his background and his intense desire to protect himself and his family....he is NEVER without "tools of the trade". He was laying in bed watching TV one night when he noticed a "dark shadow" creeping by his doorwall heading towards the kids rooms!!

BAAADD mistake on that person's part!! He grabbed his "tools" and slipped out the front door and ran around to the back....snuck up on the "perp" just as he was trying to jimmy one of the door walls to the oldest daughter's room. He grabbed the dude from behind with one hand over his mouth and put the razor sharp blade to the kid's throat and whispered in his ear..."Don't you think you should knock first?!".....The kid who was a "friend" of the daughter literally wet his pants!!! After his daughter screamed and opened the door and explained that he was a "friend" and not a criminal...she had a LOT of explaining to do.....needless to say,..she spent a good amount of time "grounded like an Iraqi pilot" and that "friend" never came back over to their house again!!!...LOL...one of life's little lesson's...."always knock first!"

 

[Bob G.]

Scott,



You crack me up! You like to stir it up and watch it unfold. What's next? Knife blade lengths, gas guzzler trucks, (wo)men's fashions?



FYI, I am using this e-mail account for now: [email protected]



Bob G.

 

[TrepMan]

Dewey - I live a few miles from Kennesaw GA. I remember reading when we moved here 8 years ago about the law on the books "Kennesaw, Georgia's ordinance requiring heads of households (with certain exceptions) to keep at least one firearm in their homes. "



According to the link below crime fell dramatically since then!!!
http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/2nd_Amend/crime_rate_plummets.htm

 

[Staci Matheis]

Pierre



Thanks for your input!



Everyone -



I went to see this film last night with my dear Friend, Laurie. (Yes, Mark, that Laurie!) We went to dinner afterward; the converstion was long and thought provoking..... We were particularly curious about the Canadian viewpoint and I mentioned e-mailing Pierre for input. Later, I just decided to post here to get an even wider range of thoughts..........



Please, we'd like to hear from others!



me!

 

[Greg Meyer]

Scott.. Pierre... Violence, wheteher by gun, knife or fist is deterred by "culture" and "rearing" much more than by legislation... Both the US and Canada traced a similar history of settlement... Firearms played a big role in our collective past... The violence that now confronts us has less, much less, to do with the availablity of firearms than it does with the attitudes of the "users". Switzerland and Israel have very liberal possession laws... Israel suffers from violence for reasons unrelated to their firearms policies... Switzerland suffers from very little gun violence... Again, almost certainly unrelated to their firearms policies. Violent crime in Great Britain is on the rise, more and more police are armed and deal with violence, yet their gun laws are draconian and long standing. It is the influx of a cultural mix that is willing to be violent that creates the problem. Just my two cents... But, people kill people... regardless of what they use.



BTW, Michael Moore is an opportunist, no documentary produced by him should bear that title...it's an op-ed piece of film.

 

[Bill McElroy]

Moore bugs me,...he rants and raves about the Evil's of big business and the social injustices inflicted on the "working man"...yet he's making millions producing these films and giving very little if ANYTHING back to Flint, MI. where he came from and now blames GM for abandoning. He's extremely opinionated and a master of twisting facts and reality around to paint a picture or send a message of how "he" perceives things. I use to listen to him with some interest and an open mind,..but after his display of unmitigated stupidity at the Oscar's, I couldn't be more grossed out by the jerk.....I hope some vet from this gulf campaign comes home and has the opportunity to "thank him for his support" in person!! Now THAT would be a film of his I'd pay to see!!! LOL

 

[Staci Matheis]

What took place at the Oscars?

 

[Pierre Voisine]

Greg,



Your points are certainly valid, especially with regards to people wanting to kill, will/can use any form of weapon. However, I don't agree that the availability of firearms has no bearing on outcome. Many people who otherwise wouln't or could'nt comit crime due to complications through other means. It is simple to pull a trigger and walk away. Again, how many crimes are commited due to pure availability of the weapon, how many crime would not have happened if the "culprit" did not have a firearm ? Sometimes, people react too quickly and would not have done what they did given time to reflect. It is certainly an easy way out to go to a pawn shop, buy an uzi and rob a bank...something I'm not would happen too often with a knife.



Of course this is another issue that is not a simple fix....there are many variables, and most if not all apply a certain percentage of the overall problem.



Scott...what do you think ?



Pierre

 

[Greg Meyer]

Pierre...



After looking at the problem from an "inside" position... I can tell you that so few incidents...almost non-existent statistically... of lawfully possessed firearms being used for "spur of the moment" or "accidental" shootings impressed me over 15 1/2 years of active law enforcement. Yes, premeditated killings with a gun... a few... Those were about even with poisonings, etc... since fear of apprehension generally requires a more subtle method... Some homicide/suicides...again pre meditated... But, as for "Joe Citizen" shooting his brother-in-law, wife, lover, etc...in a fit of rage with a handgun kept in the closet... Nope very rarely happens except in the minds and arguments of the anti-gun crowd. Gang on gang... plenty... and of course gun control has no bearing on their ability to find, procure, finance, etc their acquisition (or if it did it would not be on the rise in the UK). No, Pierre, sorry the argument that you put forth has no scientific or even anecdotal support in fact. It just sounds good, but is not supported by data or logic. It is an assumption, that's all and invalid, in my experience. Look up the real statistics and you will find them astonishing. Search through the readilty available information at the NRA.

 

[Rob LaMoy]

NOT g g g gonna t t t t TTTTOUCH this one!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Sam Elkins]

All I'm goanna say about this is Michael Moore is about as relevant to the facts as Kofi Annan and the UN is. Greg said it very well and to the point, but the facts very rarely get broadcast to the public at large. First it was cigarettes, next in line is either fast food, SUV's or cell phones and right after those will be guns.

 

[Pierre Voisine]

Greg,



Stats are an interesting thing. They generally support one's argument, if they don't they go away. Please don't misunderstand me for one in the "anti-gun" crowd, I think they have an important role in society. I just don't think everyone should have them.



Then, Greg if want to talk facts, why would the US and Canada, based on the same historical background have VERY different crime rates ? I would like to point out that influx of other cultural background is what Canada is known for. We are nothing but a melting pot of varied backgrounds. What are the fundamental differences between the US and Canada that make for such a different outcome >?



Pierre

 

[Greg Meyer]

There are some non-pc issues here, but our "ghettos" are filled with cultures that you do not have in the same mix. And, whatever the root causes are that we have not dealt with effectively, banning guns will not deal with it either. If you take out the gang and drug related violent gun crime it is virtually non-existent in the US. I know, because I "lived it"... So, deal with the gang and drug problem (poverty and no education) and you will deal with the violence.

 

[TrepMan]

Scott - Here is what happened at the Awards:



LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Politics grabbed center stage at the Academy Awards (news - web sites) on Sunday as the winner for best documentary, director Michael Moore (news), charged President Bush (news - web sites) with waging a "fictitious war."



Wagging his finger from the stage as he was both applauded and booed by the assembled celebrities, Moore said, "We are against this war, Mr. Bush. Shame on you."



Moore won for "Bowling for Columbine," a provocative film on the roots of gun violence in America, whose title refers to the Colorado high school where two students massacred 13 people before killing themselves in 1999.



Moore, who received a standing ovation from the assembled celebrities, invited the other nominees for best documentary film to join him onstage in solidarity against the war against Iraq (news - web sites).



"We like nonfiction and we live in fictitious times. We live in a time where we have fictitious election results, that elect a fictitious president. We live in a time where we have a man sending us to war for fictitious reasons," Moore said.



Oscar host Steve Martin (news) joked after Moore finished speaking that "the Teamsters are helping Mr. Moore into the trunk of his limo."


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20030324/en_nm/oscars_politics_moore_dc_7

 

[Rob LaMoy]

If anyone believes what that clown spews then shame on you for claiming to be an educated objective adult. Sorry, I know everyone is entitled to their opinion, but Mr. Moore IMHO opinion is now a traitor and has always been an absolute moron! His argument has NO factual basis at all and if you guys want REAL facts on gun control, let me know. I can bombard you with undisputable proof that gun control DOES NOT WORK. In fact it does the exact opposite. That's all I have to say about that, less I'm asked more. Momma always said, "Life is like that, if you hang around folks like Moore you gunna get stoopid all over ya!"

 

[TrepMan]

Since i'm realy a NON-participant in the Gun area (don't own one, unless you count my BB-gun for college Rat killing!, but don't believe in much Government regulations in most things), when it comes to supporting out troops in the war (or any war for that matter) I feel strongly that you CAN protest the use of Military force if you so choose BUT you MUST also SUPPORT the men and women of our Military!! IF for not for those men and women we would NOT have the safety and freedom we do in this Democratic Republic!!! Then again, from what I read, most of the protesters are lead/coordinated by the Socialist Party/Movement so their goal is NOT to keep america a FREE Democratic Republic anyway!!!



To Scott's question on Canada vs. US I think there is a lot more then government regulations (or lack there of) involved. There is a HUGE culture issue in this too!

 

[Staci Matheis]

Mr. Moore puts forth a very interesting premise in his film.....



He suggests that there is a "fear factor" in the United States that exists no where else.......... A "fear factor" that is promoted by everything from our news media giving highest priority in their coverage of violent crimes..... To our government painting pictures of foreign nations wishing to harm us..... To internal organizations such as the Klu Klux Klan and Michigan Militia.....



He suggests that this "fear factor" spawns an "I'm gonna get you before you get me" reaction.....



Are we Americans so very fearfull?



me?

 

[Michael Snow]

I don't think it's "fearful" as much as "we aren't going to take it"...

 

[Jr. Dunn]

Sorry but I had to finally speak up. The problem with the crime rate here is not that guns are available! The problem is, our level of punishment for committing a crime is not adequate to be a deterrent.

Extreme example: I guarantee if you were caught speeding and instead of getting a ticket/fine, you knew the officer was going to just "pop a cap in your arse", you would think twice before breaking the speed limit!

There is also an issue of personal accountability here (or lack of)! I'm sorry but there should be no such thing as repeat offenders of capital crimes!

"HARD time" and yes, I am a proponent of the death penalty! Oh yea, and ONLY ONE (QUICK) APPEAL and if you lose, well, that's obvious.

 

[JAMES MOORE]

It really all goes back to the loss of values in our society and the believe that no one is responsible for their actions. Besides that the believe that a gun commits a crime is halariuos. I've yet to see a gun any gun for that matter, that commits any crime in of itself. Some one has to be behind the trigger. We're always looking to put the blame on something else rather than take responsibility for our actions.

 

[Bill McElroy]

Excellent narative and pespective from two of the people "in the business"...Thank you Greg and Smitty for all that you do!! You guys are hero's!!! Be careful out there...

Mac

 

[Jr. Dunn]

I couldn't agree more smitty (and unfortunately couldn't just shut up with that) but is just adding officers, making more arrests and sending more people to prison really the solution? I know here, due to the prison over-crowding problem, they are even actually wanting to release inmates that were convicted of drug violations!



My hat is off to the officers that have to deal with this kind of crap on a daily basis but I truely believe until we stand hard and fast on criminal convictions and implement a punishment that is truely effective, the problem is going to do nothing but get worse. If you have mice, you don't just lock them up or transport them to another area...................Guess I better just shut up now.

 

[Rob LaMoy]

THANK YOU Smitty for putting forth TRUTH to squash the nonsense that people like Moore go around shouting. Scott.....our government "paints a picture" that other countries want to do us harm???? Paints a picture, as if to imply that it's not true? I certainly hope you are not sincere. I think Bin Laden and Hussein have painted the picture pretty clearly themselves thank you very much. Our government had no paint on their hands 9/11, and I would dare to say that the threat is VERY real and NOT exxagerated. Sorry, but I'm about to snap on this one, so I'll just bow out before I say things I shouldn't.

 

[Scott Smith]

Jr.,



I am merely suggesting that more officers may be part of the solution. I made no mention of sending more people to prison, frankly they are overcrowded already. Our nation, states and local governments could not afford to build enough prisons/jails for all the people that deserve to be there. My job is to catch the bad guy, I'm the first step in the judicial process, once I'm done booking him, his fate is essentially out of my hands. Improvement needs to start somewhere, why not at the bottom so to speak..? The more officers that are visible on the street, the better chance that Joe Dirtbag will get scared out of your community and take his business somewhere else, eventually getting desperate enough to the point of being easily caught by the increased amount of uniforms on the street.



I don't know what all the answers are. As it stands, we just keep putting our fingers into the leaks in the dam. Eventually we're gonna run out of fingers, and lawlessness will prevail and we'll be back to the wild wild west all over again.



As for Michael Moore...? I saw his rant, and personally it would give me great pleasure to be his personal escort out of this country. I just hope I can pull my foot out of his behind when I'm done kicking his a$$ across the border...!!



It is a breath of fresh air to have dignity restored to the White House. I am proud of my President and in love with my country...!!



God Bless our troops....!! I'm behind em 100%

 

[Jr. Dunn]

Amen Smitty!

I think we are basically on the same page. I just wish our judicial system would take it on from where you guys leave off. You guys go out and risk your lives dealing with that crap and then they turn around and turn them loose. That would be a little more than I could handle. Again, my hats off to you and those like you!

 

[Scott Smith]

Thank You Jr., it's nice to hear that every now and then....

 

[Bill McElroy]

 

[Staci Matheis]

Go ahead, Mac!

Say it!

 

[Bruce Freeman]

Well I have given this at least 3 days and the subject may or may not have drifted off course. The Short version is the laws we have are not being enforced in the courts? I have no opinion on Canada because I have only been there once and don't have the information to make an opinion. Having been robbed at gun point was the worst thing I ever have had to deal with..It's been 16 mo's now and I still cringe sometimes. I obey 99% of the laws and pay my tickets when I get caught on speeding. I do have a Colt 45 within reach at home even though I pray I will never have to use it. For those who want to blame the tool instead of the criminal? The sign on the door said Open not Rob me. The problem IMHO is education or lack there of,jobs and Drugs.

Herione,cocaine and pot are not scapegoats. They are how most of the offenders grow up. People say that selling drugs is a victimless crime but these addicts have got to get there money somewhere to support there habbits and they are to dumb or stoned to hold down a job. My unpopular answere is population control.. There are to many unwanted children in areas that can not support them and being that they don't know any better crime breeds more crime.

I did not want to offend anyone but I did need to voice my opinion.

BF

Sorry about the spelling

 

[Mark Hofman]

On Saturday March 22, 2003 at about 9:30 pm, my wife opened the house door leading into the garage to make sure the garage lights were off and the door was shut (the lights were on and the door was open because I was prepping the boat and my gear for our Spring Break fishing trip).



She got the door open about a foot and a half, then SLAMMED the door shut and shrieked, "Somebody's in our garage!!!!" She body-blocked the door as she tried to lock it.



In less than five seconds, I had a 12-gauge in my hands in case whoever it was tried to force entry. Five minutes later, I did a walk-around of our house with a flashlight and my Beretta .40 handgun.



Is Michael Moore right about the "fear factor"? I would have to say yes. I was very afraid that whoever that was in our garage would have tried to get at my wife. He didn't, but knowing that I had the ability to defend ourselves makes me believe that Mr. Moore's anti-gun rant is the work of an idiot with no common sense.

 

[Bill McElroy]

Moore IS an idiot.....what did you do or say to the dude in the garage??...did you advise him that he should "knock first?!"...LOL

 

[Mark Hofman]

My guess is that he split before I could confront him. The big door was still open, and it was dark.



My wife saw me come around the corner with my Remington 870 in hand and gave me "The Look" (like, "Give me a break."). I said, "What would you want me to do if he kicks in the door?" She then questioned if she really saw something. I opened the kitchen/garage door and looked out, but didn't see anything, then closed the main garage door with the remote opener.



A couple of minutes later, after discussing my stupidity at leaving the big door open, I told her, "I'll sleep better if I know that he isn't outside waiting for us to turn out the lights and go to bed." I retrieved my handgun and a big Maglite flashlight, and did the exterior walk-around.



She must've caught him right after he walked in the garage. Nothing was distrubed or missing. Even now, she wonders if she really saw someone. By her reaction and screams, I believe she did. When she was a teenager, she missed walking into their being-burglarized house by twenty seconds. As she opened the front door, the burgler was going out the back. She still can't shake the fear from that episode, and I think this one brought back those memories.



On one of my business trips, I once had someone try to break into my room, with me in it! All I could do was call the front desk. That's NOT the kind of defense I want to rely on.

 

[Greg Meyer]

Mo...



Quite a few years ago... I had the flu on New Years and was sleeping on the couch downstairs... heard some noise and sort of woke up and then heard it again... Guy was trying very hard to open the front door with a pair of vice grips... Silly Boy!!!! I actually had to finally very quietly unlock the door and help him fall into the house... Turned on the light and showed him my .45..very close look...right in the eye socket! I made him take off his shoes and socks and the handcuffed his one hand and then made him go back out onto the cement front porch and close the other cuff on the iron railing. Then, I made myself a pot of coffee... and when it was done called my local deprtment and told them who and what I was and that I had a 'burglar' cuffed to my front porch... didn't tell them he was doing a shoeles Joe Jackson imitation!!!! Anyway, when the Patrolman got there...he souldn't stop laughing at the guy.. he was sitting "indian style" with his feet up off the cement and his one hand way up in the air cuffed to the railing...crying about how !@#$%^ stupid he was to try to rob a cop's house!!!! The nice young Patrolman and I had a cup of coffee and watched the freezing "perp" through the storm door... He got probation and a "lecture" from the judge... who also suggested that he confine his crime sprees to warmer weather!

 

[Scott Hammer TOXIC]

Had a guy break into a third floor apartment I once lived in. He climbed up the balcony rail. I went over to my closet pulled out the pump and walked into the livingroom (where the screen door was) sat down on the carpet in my underwear in the dark and waited for him to come through the screen sliding door. I was trying to decide whether or not to put a serious hole in him or to just scare him. I decided that if I blew him away there would be a lot of paperwork and a trip downtown dfor a statement etc.. so I waited for him to come in and I chambered a round (very loudly. He ran through the screen door, hit the rail and landed flat on his back on the ground. I put three rounds (one on each side of his head and one on top) in the ground and I'll tell you this, he screamed like a little girl and ran faster than I have ever seen a human move. He never came back.......



TOXIC

 

[Greg Meyer]

Toxic... that guy just now ran past my place screaming about some crazy !@#$%^&*()'er.... I suspect he will still be running in another ten years... loud noises have that effect on some people...

 

[Scott Hammer TOXIC]

I used to go door to door collecting for a finance company way back when. Funny how rounds whizzing by your head sound just like bumble bees!!



TOXIC

 

[Greg Meyer]

First time in combat that is exactly what I thought till the Sergeant who job it was to keep his Lieutenant alive said; as I was swatting around my head with my hands, "Lietenant those are incomeing rounds not bugs...best get down, son..." I was not the least bit angry at the "son"... matter of fact he became my parent, father confessor and best friend...

 

[Scott Hammer TOXIC]

I used to do the dirty work that no one else would do. Ever see the series..Repo Men? Yep that was me at one time. Let's see, I've legally confiscated, cars, trucks, aircraft, furniture, yachts, cattle, farm impliments, wedding rings, race horses, snowmobiles, semi's, construction equipment and I'm sure a lot more than I can remember. And by the way, the yacht was Roger Staubach's (before he made it in real estate). Did some business with Willie Nelson and one of the old nasty Oakland Raiders, Conrad Dobler (best known for biting off another players ear). Ohhhh have I got some stories......



TOXIC

 

[Mikel Stephens]

My $.02:

I will always have a firearm close to protect my family. My children will be raised to respect and undertand the uses of weapons. As Americans our right to bear arms will prevent an invasion of our borders. I live in Texas where we can carry a concealed handgun. As of January 1, 1996 we could take a course and apply for a license to carry a concealed weapon. Our violent crime rate has gone down since this became law. It can be argued that violent crime is down over much of the USA though. You can read about our crime rate at the link I have provided below. I have also provided a link to a study that was done concerning the arrest rate for concealed handgun license holders. A very interesting statistic: Over the first, 4-year period, no concealed handgun license holder had been arrested for negligent manslaughter. Our crime rate dropped from 43rd to 38th in that same period of time. Of course, the death penalty and our tougher punishment for criminals has helped too.

My father is a CHL holder and actually used his weapon to protect a Sherriff who had been ran over by a car. The offender was trying to run over the officer again when my father, who had witnessed everything and was standing nearby, fired his weapon in the air. The offender then turned and sped away and was caught a couple of blocks from where he was trying to kill the officer. You can imagine the officers joy at still being alive. They both agreed that the guy would have ran him down and hit him again if my father hadn't acted with his firearm.

I beleive that 2 things contribute to more deaths in the USA. #1 being simply there are more people here. #2 would be the cultural diversity here in the USA.

Just my $.02 for discussion: not meant to offend anyone who thinks differently.

btw TOXIC: I did furniture, electronics and finance collections for almost 10 years-never again!!!



only 1 link worked so ehre's the other: http://www.tsra.com/arrests.htm
http://www.todayfoundation.org/atac/howmuchcrime.shtml