weight of out Mercury 200 h.p.

[brantley moats]

Can anyone give me weight of the older (approx. 1999) 200hp Mercury motor #OG937952 and the newer(2006) Mercury 200 h.p.; model 200L # 1B372665. Trying to figure out if the repowering of my boat before I got it is the problem with poor hole shot performance and porpoising problem at low speed. I have a 1999 896 Savage Nitro. Looking at relocating batteries per HAVACoutdoorsman post in aug. of 2012. Thanks to havacoutdoorsman for your post.

Brantley

 

[Scott Hammer TOXIC]

A personal opinion here, porpoising is a setup problem coupled with prop, driver input and trim. What speed does it start? What prop do you have? What are the conditions when it happens? And before the "whale tail" fan club starts, I don't like them. Unless it is a rare case of needing to run at very low speeds, or needing to get on plane in very shallow water, they are a band-aid fix to a set up problem and on larger motors pose a safety risk turning at high speeds.

 

[Dan J.]

Between '96 - '99 I ran several 896's (Savage & std. trim) and have listed a couple of their setups in my boat profile. The best starting point I found with a 200HP was a 25P Trophy prop (the old standard or with a Plus series, two medium plugs in and two removed in balance.) The results were regardless of EFI/DFI/Carb. engines. It provides great hole shot, top end, low end, and overall maneuvering. Porpoising only came into play with inaccurate trim applied in regard to speed and battery rigging was factory 24V without any need to reconfigure. Jack plates in several offsets and styles or flat on the transom made little difference with the 200/25P Trophy combo, but top end did marginally improve with further offset. The 25P Tempest was a decent backup, but hole shot suffered as did low end handling. Top end between the two were within a MPH. Both of the props in my best configuration were B&B by Rich Boger, but the info stated is based on stock props before blueprinting. My best is listed in my profile with one of the early DFI/Opti's on a 12" Paralift. I always run my boats pretty light since I'm not (6'4"/300lbs.) and load fuel I'm going to use, only topping off when I know I'm going to burn it out that day. I've helped several other 896 owners with these tips and they've found a noticeable improvement with the problems you've cited. I hope you do as well. Good luck!

 

[brantley moats]

Sorry it took me so long to reply been trying to get those yardwork, honey-do's before the spring weather gets here. I get a resentment when someone wants me to "do this do that" when the weather is nice for fishing.

Toxic , the prop is a Mercury Tempest Plus 23p (ser.#48-825864)with all three plugs removed. The jack plate is a Pro Hi-Jacker HP. The boat seems to labor getting up on plane i.e. it takes longer to get up on plane than other boats that I get the opportunity to fish in.The porpoising starts when you come off plane and the speed drops enough for the boat to come off the pad. You then have to slow way down and idle in or the porpoising will continue. The porpoising happens whether the water is calm or rough allthough if it get real rough , I'm subject to just put the boat on the trailer and come back later. I believe i read somewhere in here that a good starting point for distance from pad to centerline of prop was 5.25 inches. I will measure this and gt back to you on what mine actually is.The boat can exceed the redline of 5775 for this motor in wot on water with a nice chop. I am careful not to go over about 5500 anyway. toxic, I am of the same opinion as toxic about the use of a whaletail contraption.

Dan J., How do I look at your boat profile you mentioned, looks like a good place to start since you already have experience with this rig? I not trying to get every last mph out of the rig but i know with a top speed of 59.5 m.p.h. on the gps I am missing something here. That was on a good day with the wind in my face and a small chop on the water.

Any help ya'll can give would be appreciated, since I dont really relish the idea of relocating my batteries to balance out the boat.

Brantley

 

[Dan J.]

Brantley - With all three plugs out of that Tempest 23 you are blowing out and cavitating your prop, killing most of your effective HP applied to the blades for lift and speed out of the hole, which sounds like the largest issue on your hole shot. You should put two medium plugs in to get your blades to bite and get you up and out of the hole, but you'll most likely be hitting the rev limiter before you get stretched out. The reason why you're hitting the rev limiter is because that prop is just too small for a good top end with your combo, however with the two PVS plugs in you should pop out of the hole real well. If you want to keep that prop on there you will need to manage the RPM's yourself to keep that powerhead together. Refer to my original post about the Trophy 25P (4 blade) prop for the best all around performance with your combo. Also, if that 23 has dings or nicks you'll be looking at even less performance, plugs or no plugs, but again you need two medium plugs in your hub on that 23P or 25P three blade Tempest to cut the cavitation. If you can get a loaner Trophy 25 (PVS or original) I'll bet you will be stunned over what you are currently experiencing.



I've attached a link to a diagram for prop to pad measuring. Your sweet spot should fall in the 3.5" range, but start lower and work up using your water pressure gauge as your guide and keeping 12-15 PSI on the needle, particularly in tight turns. Also, you need to adjust your trim down as your speed drops down to control your porpoising. Some hulls will let the driver slide on this, but most will not. Your trim is in direct correlation to your speed and when mismatched low speed porpoising will occur. While backing off the throttle, bump down on the trim and you will find that sweet spot that'll become second nature while driving.



You can find member boat setups by clicking the "M" next to a member name and clicking on their boat link in their profile. Good luck and let us know how it goes with these adjustments made.
http://www.jaymartinpropellers.com/id26.html

 

[Mini]

All great advice (as usual) from Dan.

 

[Matthew Wolfgram]

Dan,



The one thing that I had happened with my rig was when I switched from a Tempest 24p to a trophy 24P I was getting extreme blowout on hole shot, regarless of plugs being in or out. I spoke to some local motor shops around town some mentioned about a blowout ring aiding while other said it would only make things worse. After embarrassing myself during 2 tournaments, plowing for 15 secs before coming up on plane while other blew by me, I bit the bullet and spent the $13.00 on this blowout ring. It was night and day. The ring was the ansewer to the holeshot. Still not 100%. So without dropping to a smaller pitch for better grab I elected to try relocating my batteries (Fairly simple to do). Not sure if it was the right thing to do, but it is amazing now. I did not want to go to a 25p for fear that my holeshot would go to the dogs again. Right now I get about 63-64mph with a tempest 24p. With my Trophy 24p I was only getting about 61mph. I went back to my tempest after relocating my batteries, and my holeshot still performed perfectly. No porpoising down as low as 13mph. If you don't think a 25p would kill anything, ie.top end. I'd be willing to give it a try. Would like to put my batteries back to where they were, can use that extra storage space. What about going to a fury prop??? Less flex, better grab???

 

[Dan J.]

HVAC - I'll bet your Trophy 24, unless cut down from factory specs, is a large hub prop which is a dog in that combo. The 25P Trophy out of the box is a small hub prop allowing more low end RPM's to rev up and get out of the hole. More blade face for grabbing water matched with the proper ventilation gets you up and out of the hole and the longer rake gives more top end without eating the rev limiter. I've tried a number of props on the 896 and found that the 25P Trophy was the one that had the best marriage of hole shot and top end and others were one or the other and most times neither without a whole lot more hassle on that particular hull design/configuration. Good luck!

 

[Matthew Wolfgram]

Actually the 24p trophy that I have is a small hub prop. That's why I needed the blowout/weed ring. It goes around the hub portion of the prop and then you place it on the shaft and torque her down. Without the weed ring I was blowing out way too much exhaust gas causing the motor to rev high and no holeshot. As soon as I put the ring on, I took all my plugs out and that was the trick. Like I said, only problem I had was losing some mph's off of top end. I took a quick look at you set-up for your '98 savage. How the heck did you get 74mph out of her??? The most I've ever gotten with mine is 66mph, with the wind at my back, light chop and then the boat started to chine on me.



I've got a 200 Opti, 24 tempest, 5" hydraulic jack plate.

 

[Dan J.]

:lol: The older hull datas (pre 2000) in my library were calculated using a prop slip calculator and 10% slip (if I remember correctly) and before GPS. I ran those hulls during current year productions and set up correctly the 25P Trophy would carry 70+ pretty easy, from what I remember 15 yrs. ago. (I've slept since then. :lol: ) My best with that hull was with a 12" Paralift and B&B prop (Trophy 25) from Boger and I don't believe it too far off from slip calculations. Bumping up slip to 12% might be more realistic with load and it still holds low 70's strong. I was guessing at your hub size possibly problematic when you were talking about a blowout ring to reduce cavitation. Without manually throttling down how are you not into the rev limiter stretched out with the 24? Have you had the prop worked and have you tried a Trophy 25P? (PVS 2 out/2 in) That prop with a 200, jacked or not, has benefitted a number of 896 owners. All of this on straight hulls without damage or rebuild, just to be clear.

 

[Matthew Wolfgram]

I've not yet tried a 25p trophy. I'm very tempted to now though. My hull to my knowledge is o'natural. The hull is is good shape, with just a few small chips at the rear by the stepped transom. Other than that pretty good. The speeds I had were read off of GPS but if you were to take a glance at the speedo, it was reading about 70-72mph. Way off the 66mph mark. I may actually look into buying a 25p trophy as I'm begining to fish some larger lakes and tournaments, and I would really appreciate the better control with the 4-blades. There are times, more so when lift the jack plate, the the motor hits the rev limiter. I've only had this happen twice, one of which I had a strong wind at my back. I did have my tempest re-built as I dug it into some sand/gravel at a shallow launch while loading the boat (costly dumb mistake):angry:. But no real modifications that I know of. The prop was on the boat when I purchased it this past year.

 

[Dan J.]

I wouldn't buy the 25 Trophy before trying it first, particularly with the weight redistribution you have gone through with your batteries to the bow. I'd check around with your dealer or prop shop that has an unadulterated loaner to try and make sure it performs with your mods before laying out the Loonies for it. (Without a blowout ring.) As long as your pad is not damaged you should see very good all around performance with the 25P Trophy at the top end hitting the 5750-5800 RPM range. Good luck and let us know how it goes.

 

[Matthew Wolfgram]

Thanks a lot Dan! Really appreciate you help. Will definetly let you know. But you'll have to wait a few months until the 12" of ice diappears off the lakes up here in Canada. lol