Rant: The Saudis

  • Thread starter Rich Stern [URL]http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?t
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Rich Stern

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In Saudi Arabia, it's probably difficult to find a "WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE" poster showing the face of a Saudi terrorist. Ironically, you can find a poster with a true menace: Barbie.



See linked article for story.



Somebody needs to find an alternative to oil. The sooner we don't need their oil, the better. Then we can decide if we're really "friends" with Saudi Arabia, simply on merit rather than price per barrel.


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030909/ap_on_re_mi_ea/saudi_barbie
 
I heard about this on the radio on the way into work this a.m.........absolutely rediculous!!! That whole region over there is just screwed up!!! I agree Rich,..I hope I live long enough to see the day where we don't need their oil or their "friendship" anymore!! Unbelievable!!



 
It amazes me how the tiniest, most innocent thing can set people off.
 
Thank god for the freedom we have in the USA. Now we do get our share of right wing radical religous folks. Remember the Ministers protesting "Teen Age Mutant Ninja Turtles" 10 years ago? They had a HUGE campain against the turtles and the company that marketed them because "they instill idol worship in our children and support beastiality

" since the Turtles are half human! What about the current anti-Harry Potter folks, who believe Rollings is mass-marketing witch-craft? The biggest difference in my mind is in the USA we do not have our government ENFORCING these views of one religous state or any religious view.



On September 11th I salute our men and women who died at the hands of coward terrorists, the men and women of our armed forces and pray that our proud country has the guts to continue our seperation of church and state!
 
Call me conservative... they have a point about no need for a doll to have the "figure" of a grown woman, and at times, she does dress slutty.
 
No, Mike, they don't.



If they were saints living saintly lives, perhaps they would have a point. But a society that implicitly supports the mass murder of innocent people looks a little silly when it makes a fuss over the dimensions of a plastic doll.



And that's the point.
 
PETA!

You're Safe!

Rich has a new pet peeve!!



:^)

me!



(Now don't everyone go gettin' their shorts in a bunch! Rich knows I respect him absolutely!)
 
Rich, somehow you're forgetting that we all have our issues that are near and dear to us. No one can be right about everything (except me, of course :) ).



(religious speech ahead)... I guess it's like becoming a Christian to a degree. If you wait until you've gotten your life in order and are without sin to become a Christian, you'll never become a Christian. (religious speech over).



Or maybe it's like my daughter not having to clean her room because the rest of the house is a mess... that argument is nice, but it doesn't work (she doesn't speak yet, so it's coming).



No, they may not have their priorities straight, but on this one, single issue, I agree to an extent with their VIEW of the doll (not the fines and such).



Of course, I remember when GI Joe was ONE person (action figure) and Barbie was white and blonde. So, I'm an oldie :).
 
I find it interesting that they deem Barbie to be "offensive" - then plaster a poster of her in revealing clothing on their website!







With all due respect to all religions, some of the most greivous persecutions in history have been done in the name of religion and by all religions..... Muslims are no different.



I only wish that we could stop at the good religions accomplish by instilling a moral basis in our lives.....
 
Mike, maybe you need to read the article, if you haven't already. References to "Jewish" Barbie dolls sums it up nicely: The Saudis are injecting a message of western and religious intolerance in a morality message to their people.



I'm not focused on this one issue. It's the latest in a pile of issues with the Saudis. Saudi Arabia is a breeding ground for hatred and anti-western terrorism. The fact that official Saudi messages in English are usually very conciliatory toward the west, while their Arabic messages to their own people tend to be very inflamatory toward the west. The fact that when they feel threatened by Saddam Hussein, we can have troops stage for battle on their soil, but when others are threatened by Saddam Hussein, our battle preperations are not welcome. The list goes on and on.



The Saudi ruling family wants us as a customer, but they need popular support at home to avoid rebellion, so they stir the pot against us. The problem with that approach is it breeds rogues who crash planes into buildings and strap bombs to their bodies while seeking to blow up American GIs, as well as Israeli toddlers and senior citizens.



I don't think your daughter will have the same concept in mind when she says she won't clean up her room.

 
This suicide bomber mentality of theirs is totally insane. I saw a program on the History Channel the other day that was all about the suicide bombers.....absolutely insane!!

They even have "costumes" for infants and little kids depicting those idiots!! They showed pix's of 6mos. old babies dressed up as suicide bombers!!! What's up with that??!! They instill in their kids from the day that they're born that it's honorable and glorius to blow yourself up and kill innocent people in the name of your religion. The more people you kill,...the more of a hero you are,.....this mentality is something we'll NEVER change, because they will NEVER change their ways to agree with ours. This whole mid-east peace process is a waste of our time and $$$ in my humble opinion......all the talk in the world will not change a mind-set, when it's instilled in them from day one!! I have no idea what the answer is,..but this has been going on for thousands of years and it's not going to end in our life times,...unless we witness the second coming!! (and that whole concept alone is a Christian belief!!) You can't sustain any kind of peace plan over there, when you have religeous fanatics whose whole goal in life is to murder innocent people in the name of Allah.....it's absolutely crazy!! We should just tell Isreal,.."You are on your own now folks...do what you have to do, but we can't help anymore!!" IMHO

It's beyond the help of mortal men!!

 
I'll not take us down too far a path Mac, but to "just tell Isreal,.."You are on your own now folks...do what you have to do, but we can't help anymore!!"" would be a very interesting path. Because the US is one of the largest reasons that Isreal has NOT unleashed it's military arsenal and resources on the terrorists in that area. Remember 35 years ago - Isreal fought The three strongest armies in the Middle East, And wiped them out in six days. Personal I wish when Saddam in the first gulf war shot Scuds on Isreal that they would have just LEVELED that place!



But while I agree 100% that the culture of the Islamic right wing is taught from birth and is VERY difficult to change, we (the US) would have to make that decision with FULL knowledge of the possible consequences. Like the first time Isreal launched an attack, the Islamic idiots would most likely launch another attack on us. Because no matter how you try to seperate the US and Isreal, we have been linked politically and thru democracy for so long we will STILL be seen as one of the Infedel's, and they will try to punish us as well as Ireal and ANY free country.
 
Those of us in the "civilized" West tend to see things from a certain perspective, when the reality may - in fact - be quite different.



First, its important to distinguish what the goal is. In the case of radical Islam, could it be that a suicide death is viewed as a way out of poverty, pain and torment - and that doing it in the "name of God (Allah, god, whatever)" is simply a way to justify what would normally be viewed as the act of a sick mind? After all, the promise to the suicide bomber is residual fame and accolades, eternal life, seventy virgins, and the everlasting love of Allah. That's quite a different existence than that which he or she is living in now.



It's also important to acknowledge that, in radical Islam, the education system, legal system and cultural code is based entirely within the power and influence of the CLERICS. In Iraq, for example, there are assassinations and assassination attempts on the clerics precisely because they are the base of political power among the various groups.



This influence spills over into other Islam-based societies, such as Saudi Arabia, which has the two most sacred shrines of Islam - Medina and Mecca - the places to which devout Muslims pilgrimage at least once in their lifetime.



Very limited education except religious instruction, a strong sense of "persecution" by Western cultures, wealth consolidated among the very few...create an environment ripe with resentment, hostility, a sense of helplessness, and more. Add the flames of religious "righteousness" based on a very strict moral standard for salvation, and you'll see all kinds of stuff that is unexpected and befuddling to the western mind.



No religion which bases the promise of a joyful everlasting life on the works and actions of the BELIEVER is immune to this kind of intolerance. Eternity is held out as a carrot in front of the devout, and used to make him or her do all kinds of insane things to get the reward.



Even banning Barbie Dolls. Or books. Or stone monuments.



I am not excusing uncivilized behavior. But I do think we need to strive to see things from the other guys perspective before we declare what's right and what's wrong. In looking at ourselves as critically as we evaluate others, we may just see faults and shortcomings within our own code of morals that need to be adjusted.



I happen to agree with Rich and Mac and (to an extent) TrepMan. We need to extricate ourselves from the political and religious lives of people outside the U.S. We should actively seek ways to get ourselves off the dependence for mid-East oil. We shouldn't stick our noses under other people's tents unless invited. We should hold to a rigid definition of the free-establishment clause of the Constitution (separation of church and state). We should spend money on education, health care, the creation of jobs and fair employment.





And we should stomp down HARD anyone who physically attacks us.
 
This is what I love about this website. You just don't get this kind of stuff over at b.a.s.h.

Well said, all of you. I wish I had something close to as eloquent.

I'm reminded of a bumper sticker I saw many years ago on the back of an old VW that seems much more topical now than ever before. It said.......

"Dear God, Please protect me from your followers."



Harpo
 
Mo, great stuff, thoughtful and well written.



Food for thought: There is only one country in the Middle East where Arabs can vote: Israel.



The ancient Arab world contributed immensely to the development of humanity through exploration, science, math, art and language. Sadly, the most measurable contribution of the modern Arab world is fear, hatred and violence.



Talk about regressive.

 

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